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Dmitry Yudo aka Overlord, jack of all trades
David Lister aka Listy, Freelancer and Volunteer

Friday, March 8, 2013

[WoT] How Good 0.8.4 Is

The 0.8.4 update went live. And this is the feedback topic. Let's discuss the pros and ... merits of the latest major patch.

Regarding the most recent poll: What form of eSports are you interested in??

  • None of the above  - 752 (53%) - Totally explainable. 
  • Participating -  308 (21%) - Not bad at all.
  • Watching videos and live games - 255 (18%)
  • Reading news and other -  91 (6%) - this and the group above have a good chance to ultimately join those who actually participate once the necessary support is provide and eSports is more accessible in WoT
 As always the new poll is up. 


  1. Well, my 2 cents: I generally like the patch. The graphics are smoother for me (FPS went up by 5-10, not sure why), I really like the Panzer I and IC (well, Panzer I is a bit of a crap, but I still like it, panzer IC is insane, with that 7,92mm MG it can decimate pretty much any light tank it runs into, including AMX ELX).
    British TD's are a bit meh. The tier 5 one has pretty crazy armor for its tier, it doesn't seem to be overpowered per se, but considering tier 5 is full of "shoot its front until it stops moving or I do" players who can't deal with it... guess we'll have to wait for the statistics then.
    What I do not like is the copycat trend WG has been applying lately. Those tank destroyers look one like another (especially the AT), the only truly novel thing in that branch is the Alecto, everything else uses rehashed parts. I also am not a big fan of the Aufklärungspanther, which feels... cheap (Panther hull, two already existing turrets, pre-modelled guns).
    At least we have the Leopard to look forward to. What I don't understand however is why is the T7 recon Panther getting implemented in 8.5 and not the T8 RU251, that feels lame.

    1. I do agree with alot of your points here. so i wanna hear what shoud have been on the brit TDs insted in you opinion?

    2. Well, I'd start with those that actually existed. Archer, Charioteer, Challenger/Avenger - and that's just from my head. Tortoise is also okay, the tier 10... well, recycling FV215b feels kinda lame, so I'd either switch the T10 heavy tank into a Chieftain prototype, or I'd try to implement the jagdchieftain, that would actually fit the turretless line more than the FV215b. Yes, you might say those vehicles are difficult to balance - but then again, considering the fact Wargaming made up a fake Löwe with unhistorical stats, I am sure there would be a way.

    3. @Frank Davis

      Well UK T10 TD and UK T10 HT are only an variant of Conqueror (which one is a upgunned variant of Caensomething) I prefer to see all of them as some subvariants of Conqueror (like tier 9-2 or something, you really should thina about a subtiers).

  2. regarding the new pool, where is the option for "none of the above"

  3. This comment has been removed by the author.

  4. I mean that the tier 10 TD in Britian is too powerfull.
    Same with the Su-100Y.
    Do Swamp come next update?

    1. 130 mm gun -.-, i think WG want it like the Dickermax, but it has only 105mm gun, and bad armor for a tier6.

    2. I dare to disagree ... these tanks are only OP against campers that sit and wait to get hit. It is extremely easy to win against the FV destroyer, as You can stick 4-5 shots in him while he is still reloading ... not speaking of relocating as much, as You want only because it takes a month to reload that monster ... if You feel it's OP, you are most likely playing Your tank wrong.

      And SU? It dies after one nearly hit from KV2 top gun, as there is no armor on that brick what so ever, so it's only a matter of spotting it, besides ... tog has better pen than that tank ;)

    3. Tell it to poor jagdpz:D KV2 gun nearly kill everyone, but it shoot half fast.

    4. @Przemysław Majkowski "I dare to disagree ... these tanks are only OP against campers that sit and wait to get hit."

      Well, nope, they're OP in most situations in the game cause this game rewards camping and huge alpha guns.

    5. New tanks have tendency to perform a bit higher since players need some time to adjust to new tanks (especially playing against them). Will see what data show.

    6. Yeah play with a 140mm penetration gun against 203 mm armor. Its really hard to adjust:D It could be better, if the side and rear could have wors armor, 101 is brutal, t28 prototype has weaker armor.

    7. 140? There will be many tanks with 110 and lower penetration fighting against this armor :).

    8. I thougth maximum penetration:D

    9. @plasot

      Alpha damage is the least importand thing in this game. Oly fire rate and penetration are realy useful values, because they determine how effective You are in delivering that damage. Alph damage is only good and important for "one shot players" that are incapable of dealing damage with their gun potential.

    10. "Alph damage is only good and important for "one shot players"

      As in, TDs, which are not mobile, armored or fast enough to go and root out tanks that get to cover after they've taken a big nice -800hp hit from that TD hidden half a map away?

      Ofc DPM and RoF is important, but that's mainly for lights, mediums and fast heavies. Alpha is important for the rest.

    11. Alpha IMO is secondary importance for all tanks, an mostly brcause You first of all want to add one more punch before Your enemy reloads and cover before he shoots, so every time You can do two hits for each one hit Your opponent does, You will win despite that alpha. And You have to admit that turreted TDs in most situations are played just like second line support heavies.

    12. @Przemysław Majkowski "so every time You can do two hits for each one hit Your opponent does, You will win despite that alpha."

      As it seen on T6 Companies - Kw1s shots one and take 3/4 of HP of ARL and you fight it back with pew pew shooter, errr how many shots you got before KW1s reloads? Two? And the you're toast. Same apply to Ygrek.
      WG simply needs to rethink that formula describing caliber/damage dependancy (lowering it - 150 mm = lets say max 600 HP)

  5. Regarding new patch: after the patch, my FPS-drop disappeared. It was awesome for 1 day... now I have the same FPS-drop as before the patch. (Sniper mode zooming in/out)

    I didn't recognize any difference with new FV (Tier X Heavy) regarding the pre-patch version of it. :)

    The reworked maps are good, anyway! :)

  6. - No more "south coast" at least for a while -- thats great
    - sold all my t4-6 german lights/scouts, made ~830K credits from these rolling trash cans
    - was busy until yesterday to gets my mods running ... I remember something about better mod-support from WGs side. Not for the ltest patches it seems

    Havnt played that many games until now, final verdict still to come

    1. @Folterknecht

      - Pz I is too slow to got that lame gun and got too lame gun to be that slow, really hard tank to drive.
      - Pz I C is real monster when engages same tier and lower, it reaps everything apart with that MG (not so long I guess, real reaping tanks are only Soviets, how long should we wait to see T50-2 nerfed to the oblivion like VK28?)
      - Pz II G is too weak for its tier, cannon got great penetration but reloads too long and with that aiming time ammunition flies randomly (cause with 30 dmg you got no time to wait for small circle)

  7. I think the same, like Frank Davis, i think AT-2 a bit op, 203 mm armor really?The 203 mm armor for AT8 is strong too. Ok AT-2 have "weak" gun and slow, but with this reason the maus could be tier 8 with the 75 l/70. And why havent we the Archer?

    1. And why havent we a EU or japan tech tree with existing tanks, but we have a lots of fantasy of crazy engineers?

    2. Here, I count some tanks:
      Prototypes; blueprints/in service; saw combat

      Germany: 25/30
      Russia: 27/28
      China: 10/7 (counted tanks build and used by other countries)
      USA: 31/24
      France: 25/13
      UK: 16/19

      Adding fantasy guns and turrets (Schmallturm on VK3001P or T15E2 gun on M46/47) you got a nice tank-fantasy game.
      Seriously drop that ahistorical guns (we got gold ammo, right?), make some subtiers and we will back on historical accuracy track. And sack SerB.

    3. Hey APCR/prem ammo had some limited RL usage.

    4. @Overlord

      Same as normal AP rounds cause crews mostly uses HE.

    5. Which remind me of a time when i held up againts 8 enemies tank who keep on shooting at my frontal armor, cant tell where too many, some are smart enough to hit the commander port. but i shake a bit and they miss, we won that game. i hold that one line while my team finish em off from behind.

  8. Really like the reworked maps, also love that when i say something to the other team it defaults the chat to my team ;)

    Love the Pz1 C with the tier 8 radio and awesome mobility, the new TD's do seem a bit copy paste but got to admire that one shot(tier 9) capability from the FV

    Overall good patch.
    Cheers from Portugal overlord

  9. Hello Ovi

    the patch overall is nice but there is something i cant understand:

    why you removed the hummel research from the pz3/4 ??
    i was close to research it, now i have useles free xp there

    it was unnecesary i think
    and it was without notice on the release notes

    (watch out... there are ninjas at WG office) *insert ninja face here*

    1. Aye, some ninja changes do come through :)

  10. Still confused why Wargaming has not fixed its codec etc for the Headsets that use USB....please explain why this is still a issue....

  11. @ Poll

    I've got one on which I can play WoT aswell as running the assistant. ^^ So I voted "other".

    Best regards,

    PS. AT series are fat! :P

  12. I must say that I found WG's behaviour around 8.4, e.g. the sneak E-50 gun depression nerf (whimsical and arbitrary), ditto T-28 buff and the rather irrational VK-2801 changes (which doesn't address the derp issue), rather unbusinesslike. I haven't got an E-50, love my T-28 and don't play my VK much so I'm not really concerned over the changes as such, but I suddenly felt uncomfortable with being a customer of WG under such premises. I do understand and appreciate the need for balancing the game -- it's not a simulator -- but it has to be done openly, effectively and rationally. The steady and clear (as I perceive it) power creep also worries me. Not only will it require more outright (and hopefully open) nerfing, it also clearly undermines my currently held tanks (some 50 of them). If I don't feel inspired by the new tanks enough to acquire them (which I don't) it clearly undermines my incentive to play the game. Right now I distinctly regret extending my premium account for 6 months and I haven't played WoT since the open test closed. I'm not sure if this state will continue, but my impression of unbusinesslike behaviour likely will.

  13. I miss one option in the new poll: I don't have smartphone at all.
    Odious_Slug [CSF]

    1. @Ovi

      Ensk is messed up, we got flying tanks there.


    2. Not the best angle, but it looks that you have the right.

    3. @Overlord

      I thought I made whole series of screens but when I explored a folder I found only one screen.
      Here you got a screenshot taken by my clanmate (three members confirmed flying tanks):

  14. Well, I have already wrote what I think about UK TD's and I do not change my mind. We have now 6 quite similar Btitish TD's (AT-Tortois) from which only one was bulit and none was used in fight. Too many paper projects for me. Sorry Ovi, but I can't be happy, that we have yet another line without any mass produced tank.

    Both most known Birtish TD's - Archer and Achilles are not included, which is for me strange. If you decided to make 2 lines of British TD's (which is mistake IMO) so then at least more known vehicles should be first.

    IMO you want to build too many lines, specially in case of TD's.

    And those TD's have too good armor for tiers V and VI. Even experienced players will have problems with fighting them in mediums with 110 mm penetration (have fun avoiding their gun in Crusader and hitting weakspot at once).

    And we have yet another patch in which you did nothing with premium derp ammo... At least Storm wrote that he will do smth with it.

    For me that patch is one of the least interesting we ever got.

    1. You are absolutely right, instead of AT2 we could have Archer, and AT8 swap Achilles, or just the Chruchill CG.

  15. The biggest issue this game (not only the patch) is starting to have is the player base. The marketing and advertising on it is insane and working as expected. But as more and more players join, the average skill of players met in battles drops to a point where one can only quit playing instead of getting brain damage because of the stress.
    And the developers keep denying and ignoring our requests to have skill-based random matches.
    The above is the reason i quit playing WoW after 4 years, and this will be the reason i will quit playing this game at some point in the near future.
    As for the recently added models/features they are mostly ok, the silent nerfs are not ok at all. It will add more and more to the bad reputation of WG.

    I personally was enthusiastic about the patch and was eager to play and enjoy it until i've had my first 5 matches, all turning out to be humiliating loses with scores such as 3-15, 1-14, 4-15. This obliterated my mood to play and all my enthusiasm.

    I now enjoy more reading the forums, and blogs related to this game and tanks in general than actually playing it. I am also not longer motivated to buy gold and premium at all. Hope you read this Overlord. I am not expecting changes, i am content that at least someone from the dev team listens to our worries and opiniions.


    1. To some point that's inevitable with quite high influx of new players. However I do agree that challenge of educating newbies currently exists, and the recently added tutorial won't solve the issue entirely.

    2. Skill based MM is not solution and it will cause many other problems. And by the way what do you understand by skill based efficiency? That pro play against pro and noobs against noobs? Then I do not understand why I should be punished for my skill and had to fight only against highly experienced and skilled players.

      If you understand by skill based MM that teams should have balanced average skill then it changes nothing cause battles still will be unbalanced due to many reasons (for example one team will get 1500 effi player in T-29 and the other in Crusader), your teams still will be full of terrible players and waiting times for battles will be many times longer then now.

      If you are tired with randoms (which I admit are full of terrible players), play companies, clan wars and other more skill demanding fights that will be probably offered soon by WG. Or play in platoon.

      I play only randoms without platoon. And usually only 2-5 battles after which I need a brake to calm down. But I do not believe that some skill based MM will improve things.

    3. There is players in tier X that go and camp behind arty or stand next to them to "defend" arty.
      And tier X that rush and die with in 1min.
      Things like this ruin the match for the other 14 players in that team.
      And if you tell them how to help the team more they reply with "I'm in a 10 and you are in a 8, I'm better then you." But in a not so nice way.
      Please work on some thing to help them too.

    4. @dead_skin_mask
      your understanding of skill based MM, or ELO MM, is completely wrong

    5. So write me what kind of miracle skill based MM you mean. Cause all the time you all write "skill based MM", but you do not explain what you mean by it.

    6. but you already made your mind on the "skill based MM"
      so whatever I would write and link here would mean absolutely nothing

      here is an example of MWO's ELO based MM at work:

      50/50 win as it should

    7. Wow, and this is how you wanted to convince me? LOL You should show me, why my understanding is wrong, as you claim, but instead of it you just surrendered.

      You also still gave no hints what do you understand by skill MM (it can be made in many different ways).

      And I am rather not interested with MM which lowers number of my victories cause curently I win 55-60 prc of battles. So I would like to get some reward for the fact that I will be losing more often then now.

    8. convince you .. mwmwmmwhhahahah LOL

      WG's MM and constant tank rebalancing was meant to exactly do that 50/50 win
      only difference in this is that WG failed, while ELO based MMs work

      reduce your number of victories? what's it to you? why does it even matter to you
      well unless you're a stats whore who will his e-peen cut by a proper MM

      the difference is that ELO based MM will show exactly your skill depending on what bracket you settled based on your ELO rating
      while showing off in WOT is based on w/l ratio and a 3rd party rating formula that is broken

      convince you ... no, as I said, you already made up your mind
      people who want a good MM will wish for an skill based MM (ELO or otherwise) while people who want to brag about nonsensical numbers won't

    9. "WG's MM and constant tank rebalancing was meant to exactly do that 50/50 win"

      ???? I see that you have no idea about rebalancing in WoT. WG never tried to cause that all players will have 50 prc win ratio. WG do not care that I have in some tanks 60 and more win ratio as long as global win ratio of that tank is around 49.

      And amount of victories in WoT counts, cause there is XP premium for victory. The more battles you win, the more XP you get.

      You still didn't wrote, how skill MM should work in WoT (and what kind of skill MM are you writing about). The only thing that you showed me here with your posts, is that you can't discuss like civilized man and you do not deserve to be treated like an civilized man. Bye.

    10. that's not what overlord said right here on this blog a while back
      this is not 1st time we discuss ELO MM ;)

      let me see if I can find his answer from back then

    11. ELO-based MMs have become popular mainly because of eSports focus of the games with extremely tight competition. WoT tends to be a more relaxed kind of entertainment than, e.g. any dota-like game.

      And the only part of the game where we actually consider implementation of such MM system is built-in esport mode.

  16. Well I'm still adapting to the new VK 2801. It feels a lot like an upgraded pz4, which isn't bad... it's just confusing to veteran VK drivers. When 8.5 rolls around I think I'll ditch it for the next tiered scout.

    Saved up 30k experience on my Churchill, this combined with the 100k free experience I had I expected to jump straight into a tier 7-8 Brit TD - I really should have checked the experience values on the test server! With what I had I'd only be halfway through the Church Gun Carrier, so I'll just save the cash/experience.

    Love the look of the new maps, I'm hoping El Halluf and Airfield go through a color shift as well (just to differentiate).

  17. The only complaint I have is regarding the sound. Since 8.3 and now 8.4 sound issues appeared and has now gotten worse. Crew voices will stutter or do weird things, sometimes engine sounds too. This doesn't happen all the time though, start of battle being a good example of the voice issue.

    (NOT an fps issue, I run it stable at 60fps (vsynch, otherwise it goes into the hundreds).

    The game also has once again started exiting itself randomly for no reason (once in tech tree, once while battle load, once while in garage selecting tank).

    The higher UK TD's seem fun to play though I have yet to try them, they have been fun to fight. The low tiers are reminding me once again why I hate low tiers... (4 and less) :P



      Well, with some much changes to VK28, T-50-2 and Chaffee needs to me at least tier 8 to compensate it.

  18. I would like to see the Pz I get its dual MG13s as an armament (or at least one MG13 with the other gun being static). It's very strange that none of the Pz I turret/gun combinations in the game right now ever saw combat, even though the Pz I was a very widely produced vehicle.

    I understand that the penetration on the gun(s) would be terrible, but considering their rate of fire and clip size, that seems more like a balancing feature if anything!

    1. I have the Pzi c, i want it for the dual mauser, its could look cool.

  19. Overlord, some people with Nvidia mobile gpus, myself included, ended up having the gpu running at 100% in the garage view, right in the patch where it was supposed to be fixed.

    i didn't suffer of this before, it's kind of sad having to suffer from it right now where it should have been fixed.

    Do you hear any news regarding this?

    1. Not yet, sorry.

      I am running a mobile Nvidia GPU as well.

    2. Well, let us know.

      I also made a topic, and other people with nvidia mobile gpus are experiencing it.


    3. BTW. This patch brought back the nVidia Black Screen Freeze error. Almost every battle freezes my laptop. :(
      I've tried 5 older drivers, all graphics settings and utilities (PowerMizer utility) to resolve this issue. Without any real impovement regarding this issue. :(

      I have an nVidia 9600M GT card.

  20. Seems good so far. I echo my thoughts about 8.4 from the public test, however, with some elaboration:

    - SU-100Y is grossly overpowered for tier 6. The reason is obvious: too much alpha for the tier. This thing does more alpha than any other tank until tier 8! (SU-152 is only exception). I did a more detailed write up on this vehicle here: http://petukocasual.tumblr.com/post/44510539193/su-100y-u-so-op . I feel this vehicle needs to be bumped up to tier 7, and the gold rounds removed or reworked so that they don't do more damage than normal AP.

    - Still feel that VK1602 Leopard should have got one of the 75mm guns when it moved to tier 5. We must compare it to ELC AMX, and to the vehicles it is put up against: with 5cm, it has barely enough penetration to get through even moderately armored vehicles. With 3cm, it still has trouble penetrating most of the higher tier tanks it can go up against, and does barely any damage at all when it does. Whereas the ELC AMX with it's 90mm, has rarely any problems penetrating enemy armor, is faster and much more survivable on account of extremely small/low profile, and has very appreciable alpha damage. Yes, Leo is _ok_ at anti-LT role, but it is so much more susceptible to fire from other vehicles (due to it's huge size), whereas ELC/T-50 etc are small and fast enough to dodge enemy fire rather effectively.

    1. And some long-term annoyances that aren't particular to 8.4:
      - Tier 4 light tanks should have the same MM bracket as other tier 4 vehicles (with the exception of the T-50, which is fast enough to properly scout in high tier battles). None of them, not one, deserves to go up against tier 8 tanks, or really even tier 7 tanks. They aren't cut out for the job, and the excuse that they are intended to act as scouts is a poor one; excepting the T-50, they aren't near fast enough to do it effectively. As well, they are an especially difficult hump over which new players must get, in order to rise up some of the lines in the tech tree. Now that we have LTs in the upper tiers (5-8), we don't need to keep punishing tier 4 LT with a horrible MM bracket. Granted, this may require some re-examining of tier 4 LT balance, but I don't think it will be all that much. Having played most of them for a decent amount of battles, and knowing their stats, tier 4 LTs feel quite balanced when compared strictly to other tier 4 vehicles.

      - Counter-battery fire should be more heavily encouraged through game mechanics. These days, almost no SPG will bother with it because time spent waiting for enemy SPG tracers, only to have a vague hope of damaging - let alone killing - the enemy SPGs, is time wasted. This makes the problem of SPG's power-projection across the map with little risk to themselves even more of a problem, because the risk to SPGs is almost none these days. Sure, LT or MT can break through lines and get at them occasionally, but there's not much an SPG itself can do to prevent that happening - it's mostly out of his hands.

      Right now, anybody of any skill level can jump in the laser-guided bomb launchers that are the SPGs in this game and do disproportionately high amounts of damage to any tier tank from relative safety. While yes, it does take skill to be a really good SPG player (knowing when to move, prioritizing targets, etc), the skill "basement" is actually very low.

      This is a problem I haven't thought of a good, strong, clear-cut solution for. My best idea so far is to make it so that SPGs have to "deploy" and thus become temporarily immobile before they can fire, and after firing have to undeploy before they can move. As well, their position should be made more apparent when they fire. A thick and obvious smoke from the gun, for example, and/or always-visible tracers for SPGs.

      - We recently heard (source: http://ftr-wot.blogspot.com/2013/03/732013.html) that KV-1S won't be losing 122mm gun in the future. Why? This tank is another case of too much alpha for the tier, and would be easily rebalanced by simply swapping the 122mm for the 100mm D10-T. Right now, KV-1S dominates tier 6 battles handily; especially company battles where it can guarantee it's on top.

      A while back, it seemed Wargaming.net was interested in keeping high-alpha vehicles in check; as example, when the KV was split into 3 vehicles with the top guns going to the tier 6 KV-2/T-150, and when the SU-85 lost its 107mm. Now hearing this about KV-1S keeping 122mm, and the SU-100Y just introduced, it seems there is no longer much care for keeping high-alpha vehicles in check and balance, which disappoints me greatly.

    2. Yes, this 130 mm in tier VI is a bad idea. One hit from such TD and you can forget about having good battle. Nonsense and killing fun again. The same with this 183 mm gun on UK TD. You take your X tier, you get one hit, and you can forget about fun in that battle cause after such hit even fly can finish you.

      For almost 2 years I was almost always pro WG, but last 2 patches are for me worst ever.

      Due to growing amount of never produced tanks (specially in top tiers) and still often arty parties I started to sell my X tiers. As first I sold T110E4 (last battle I took him one week ago was with 4 spgs per team, I took arty safe place, but I was killed in one minute with golden ammo - I checked decals before death - 2 shots went through mantlet like through butter - and I haven't even seen 3 from 4 shooting tanks, and if I tried to hide I was easy to hit by arty. All other tanks in my team where also hidden, all apart from one far behind me. Wow, what a fun... And among last 10 vehicles that fought, 8 were spg. Is it really world of tanks?

    3. I agree with both of you. These high alpha guns are a big problem in balancing this game. I prefer to play german Tanks but every patch we are kicked in the nuts again by not buffing german Tanks, that are the way waekest Tanks in this game and still bringing out tanks that makes them more useless to play. I was a big fan of my E-75 when it was new, the armor was good, gun not really, but it was playable. Since IS-4 became Tier X and all these high-pen guns came up (270mm of penetration in tier 9) it became more and more useless to drive tanks like E-75.
      Overlord, why are you just pushing russian tanks and nerf german tanks? Do you hate them? Why don't E-75, Maus and E-100 get 270 of penetration or a way more acurate gun? they have no benefit anymore compared to other tanks in that tier.
      Why don't the KV1-S loose its overpowered gun? (by the way the KV-1S had only 85mm gun)
      I for myself still want to play so i just play tier 6-8 which are the more or less best balanced tiers. To play Tier 9-10 is, especally for german tanks, like hell.

      And for this patch:
      again the question why you don't use TD's for the british branch that saw some action like archer or achilles?
      Why did the german lights in tier 5 and 6 didn't get new guns for that tier? the 5cm gun is one of the worst even in tier 4.
      Why the hell did you put in these SU-100Y in tier 6?

      the good things of this patch.... i don't know anything
      maybe the tutorial, which is a bit too short and should be only the first of 3 or 5 tutorials to help beginners.

      Some ideas for balancing in the next patches:

      - buff Dicker Max so it is more playable (real speed of Panzer IV and better turning speed)
      - take away 122mm gun from KV-1S and replace it with 85mm or maybe 100mm gun (i have this tank my own and it is way too strong for its tier) or nerf penetration of this gun to 125mm to make it more balanced
      - make a one arty per side only MM (in all games i played this kinds of matches feels best to play)
      - nerf Arty damage but make em shoot 3-6 shells so they can "block" an area on the map or make them deploy before shooting as someone else mentioned
      - no prem-ammo for credits anymore
      - lower tierspred for lower tier (for example a tier 7 tank can't do much in a tier 9 battle, yes it can sometimes do something and you can try to attack from behind and stuff but it is very very difficult)
      - put in more historical tanks, the players like them more than blueprint tanks
      - make cast-armor less efficent (cast armor is only about 80% as strong as welded armor)

      so these are some ideas, i know it is not likely to happen but maybe you read this overlord and maybe it will change a bit.

      p.s. sorry for my bad english, i'm a bit rusty

    4. "make cast-armor less efficent (cast armor is only about 80% as strong as welded armor)"

      i know your point, but i can remember a question for one of the specialists (either doyle or pasholok) where the asker stated "that casted armor IS better and by how much".

      Just to put your feet back on the ground.... basic knowledge and propaganda in ussr countries told (and wot still tells you, so far for propaganda) em that their steelurgy is better and casting is more efficient than any western techs.

  21. This comment has been removed by the author.

  22. The patch is meh the english tds are copies of each other the only real interesting 2 at at the top, and players will have slit their wrists long before they get there.

    Removal of 2 awful maps yay. Addition of no new maps boo.

    The tutorial is fun good job there though plenty of room to expand upon it.

    The panzer c with the machine gun is well actually quite poor but best fun i've had in WOT for ages. Could you plz plz plz increase the pen by 1 or 2 there's a few tanks which are immune to its fire at the moment those 1/2 pen will allow a few hign random pen shots to get though to tanks like t-50 and amx38.

  23. It didn't make artillery playable again, so I pay it no mind. I want my fun back.

  24. Disappointed with the latest patch TBH. There may be a British TD line, but the M10 Achilles is nowhere to be seen. If not introduced now, then in God's name when? Months? Years? Never? I'd take it all back if it's released as a premium, because introducing one tank seems faster than having to wait ages for a 2nd British TD line which probably won't come anytime soon. The same goes for the Sherman Firefly.

    Once again, none of these British TDs saw active service or action. It ought to be called British prototype/blueprint line, and seperate them from the historical lines. The only reason why I bother to play at least two of them is only because of the Art of War II contest, after which they will be sold when it ends.

    And why worsen the tiering of the Luchs, Leopard and VK2801? I have never seen these tanks perform outstanding scouting maneuvers the way the T-50 and T-50-2 does. I have seen on many occasions the T-50s highlighting every enemy tank without taking a single hit in high tier battles, greatly effecting the outcome. I've never seen the Leopard or VK do anything similar (Russian bias working as intended). If they're going to be nerfed, then so should the Soviet light tanks as well.

    1. This is nothing new. This game is WORST(world of russian tanks)

    2. Guys, better don't start Tutorial in which some soviet T6 kills best of Panzerwaffe (Panther and KT). Can we got opposite tutorial? And how about using consumambles, where are tactics basic (yup, just another camping team at Malinovka at T2, really guys, this map is bad for beginners), weakspots, modules or crew damage. Game and players will have more benefits from good tutorial than from whole chinese branch.

    3. Plasot,

      I was thinking the same about the tutorial, looks like a fault to me.

  25. No more serene coast or Dragons Ridge!

    You did something right for once!

  26. seemmms proko-map is really mess-up !!!

  27. This patch suck,VK2801 was fine before now it's POS,and ignoring player fedbacks will get you in right direction!

    1. I love this type of comment, shows how much people can rage about one thing without knowing everything.

      So, for everyone who is like mister "PATCH SUCKS COS 1 TANK I LIKED GOT CHANGE, WG YOU ASSHOLES", let's recap everything :

      1. The VK2801 got changed from a "top of the line" light tanks (such as Chaffee and T-50-2) to a classic Tier 6 LT (such as AMX 12t, 59-16).

      2. It will have tanks following it, it's the fate of every "top of the line" LTs, Overlord confirmed it, SerB confirmed it, there will be german LTs on T7 and T8.

      3. While the VK2801 had its tier raised, in reality its matchmaking is lowered, it had a "top of the line" scout MM before, now it gets a softer MM.

      4. While the changes in speed and hull rotation where needed to keep it balanced with other tier 6 LTs, the VK2801 still keeps its "no-skill required" 105mm gun AND is now using it on softer targets because of its redone MM.

      So yeah, now you don't have a T5 scout which was stupidly easy to play, you get a balanced "Middle of the research tree" T6 LT.

      On another note, I am "pleased" with this patch. Sure it looks like some british TD's are gonna need some tweaking, but everything else seems "quite fine". And, maybe I am the only one, but I like the fact that WG like to introduce non-mainstream tanks in its game. I keep discovering new prototypes which are far more interesting than tanks you see in every damn WW2 video game. Keep it up.

    2. 1. If I can't see the tier VII Light tank I assume that the VK2801 is still the "top of the line".

      2. Why did they "upgrade" the VK but didn't the T-50-2 and the Chaffe?

      3. I still fight Tier IX.
      PS.:If you want you can change the "still" for "only"

      4. You need to get close to the enemy to use the 10,5cm,that's why we need the speed.The rage on the 10,5cm is because it can shoot HEAT correct?

    3. Babz, the VK2801 might on paper have gotten more favorable MM, but in reality it has the exact same MM as before. Now its just a much weaker tank, and in this patch you'll get seriously raped playing the VK2801 - its utterly useless.

      As for the Luchs - there's simply no reason to drive it - the PzIII has more health, is faster, has better traverse speed, better armor, and the same gun.

      So now you'll properly say, 'But they are scouts, you should use them as such'. Well the the new immobility, and already enormous size of German 'scouts' means, that they are easy targets to hit when trying active scouting, and too slow to get in to position, and too big to hide with passive scouting.

      So "no", Babz, its you that seems to be 'uninformed'.

      So with the absence of nerfing the T-50, T-50-2, Chaffee or the ELC, this patch is just another example of WG kicking German tanks players for no reason what-so-ever. Sometimes I feel that this game is nothing more than a mean for Serb is avenging his lost Djedooshka.

    4. The simple fact to link the two terms "light" and "scout" is quite wrong. As for the presence of higher-tier german LT's next patch will surely do the trick.

      As for the Chaffee and T-50-2, the replacement for the later is already confirmed and the chaffee may not have his tier raised, but will surely have a nerf to get higher tier tanks after him.

      As for the "uninformed", I think the people not knowing this when it's quite "all over the internet" are the one to blame.

      Also, SerB is an illuminati, eats babies and bathe in virgin's blood last time I've heard about him. So the "great german bias" is probably the least terrible thing he's doing.

  28. what happened to my ELC AMX?
    it's hull wont turn to where I point now.

    this better be fixed.because that's one of the worst thing you could possibly do to the ELC

  29. Re: the poll

    I just came from the WoT SXSW tournament, and it was a blast! Can I change my vote? :P

  30. Overlord

    This evening I finally managed to get on tutorial. Here is my feedback

    1. This is one of the finest maps I've ever seen in WoT. I would love to have similar map in game :) Probably because it looks like forests in Poland or Belorussia ;)

    2. Why we dont have this Jeep/Gaz on other maps? There is too many civil cars and too few military vehicles on maps (cars, halftracks, armored cars, guns - they would make maps more warlike, fighting in US cities seems strange for me, would be nice to have more true frontlike maps).

    3. Some people complained on that KT, but it is good to show that front armor is hardest to pen and you can much more easily penetrate sides and rear.

    4. I have only one complain. Why there is no sniper mode. It is much easier to snipe (last part of tutorial), when you go into sniper mode. It should be IMO there included. Player takes one or 2 shots, he will most probably miss that Panther, so there should be text "It is hard to hit moving target in arcade mode. Press shift and then you could aim with greater precision".

    This is that kind of tutorial I was thinking about, when some time ago I was writing that there is need for good tutorial cause average players have very low knowledge about game. Step by step, from basics to more advanced features, showing not only interface and controls, but also explaining tactics and game mechanics. Of course there need to be more parts with bigger sophistication, but it is step in right direction. IMO best part of that patch, although very short.

    1. Ähm.... in the last part, there is snipermode.
      But you must move into the green circle. Or better said, he needs to disappear.

    2. Hmmm, I was standing in that circle, behind bush, and I couldn't get to sniper mode (tried both scrolling and shift). I killed that Panther in arcade mode. Maybe I wasn't directly in the circle, I will check when I again manage to get to tutorial.

      And yet again to Ovi.

      There should be in such tutorial explanation, when player should shoot at the target. You know, there are whole armies of players shooting at rocks, hills or buildings cause they see tank icon behind them. I have seen stats of some of those "hill killers" and some of them had 5-10 prc. hit ratio! There should be tutorial for spg - some people in low tiers do not know that they should press shift and use indirect fire.

      Next tutorials should explain vehicls role in battle, how play sniper vehicle in the way which will be helpful for team (often low experienced snipers sit all battles in one place, when they are useless cause enemy is somwhere else). There should be tutorial showing how important is minimap, coming back to base, and so on. Maybe you should collect some feedback about biggest mistakes made by fresh players, to make turotial more efective in turning them into decent players?

    3. After making tutorial second time I now see that I stopped too much in front of that bush, so sniper mode wasn't turn on :)

      So I think tutorial is OK. Now we need more episodes :)

  31. You really had to stealth nerf the e 75?? Just because the light caused a texture overlay you didn't have to nerf the depression!! If you haven't noticed ITS JUST A LIGHT!. Either get rid of it or put it further down the UFP. Getting tierd of theese ninja nerfs to the e series. ( e 50/m and now e 75) get it together OL.

  32. This patch to me is just another mediocre about the only good part is the updated maps. More tanks not impressed. If I recall there was a discussion of 2k maps. I personally feel that the view ranges radio ranges were designed for maps that are 2kby2k. At present these ranges are to great for these small maps. MM still not fixed for balanced matches,to many arty in matches. There should be more focus on modes maps balancing the MM. This company has been provided countless information on these imbalances with to many arty in a match and still nothing is done totally ignored by WG

    The rework of maps have been exceptional Battlefields are needed in this type game simply because its gets boring after a bit especially when u fight on the same maps 3 or 4 times in a row.

    I have no issue with gold rounds in the game load outs should be what they are historically for each tank.

    One of my biggest cripes is that you guys have chosen to place old tank against newer tech. To me there should be a cut off. I believe that you Overlord once spoke of correcting the speeds of the Tiger 1and 2 tanks and to this date you have not. T2 Maximum, road: 41.5 km/h (25.8 mph)[5]
    Sustained, road: 38 km/h (24 mph)[5]
    Cross country: 15 to 20 km/h (9.3 to 12 mph

    T1 38 km/h (24 mph
    When I see this correction in game then and only then will I see that you r truly going in the right direction. When this corrected I will post other discrepancies. Granted this is only minor but I think that you guys really want to be as close as to history as possible.

  33. Hi Overlord!
    New French heavy tank line when can we expect?
    Which update?
    Maybe 8.5?

    1. 8.5 will be dedicated to Germans.

    2. This comment has been removed by the author.

    3. and german get one or two new line?
      and what type of lines?
      thx the answer

    4. German medium line with Leo.

  34. Hello :)

    First thing I checked were maps.. I really like how you fixed Prohorovka! As for the reworked ones, Steppes are awesome. Live Oak and Ensk are almost same but better outfit I guess. Yeah, you made a good job at the field on Ensk, those formations of bushes and trees are nice. Fisherman’s Bay is nice, although I am sad cause I still can't go on that bridge :D

    As for the vehicles.. well, hard to tell. Because of the current event it feels like I'm on test server, each of those new tanks is spitting gold hahah

    But! I noticed that Alecto has a bit, strange.. sound on his top gun
    [ 25-pdr AT Gun-Howitzer ]. It's 87mm but it sounds like I'm shooting from 152mm like KV-2. It's nice feeling but a bit strange.. don't you think?

    And yeah, Valentine AT.. it seems like I just can't see the good side of it.

    It's slow, okay.. and stats show that at least you get some armor, but when it comes to absorbing damage that thing just can't do it. Tier II penetrates that cover around the gun with ease. Elevation/depression and overall gun movement is pretty limited, so you really, really have to watch out what are you doing..

    Maybe it is just me and that the tank is hard to master, but my current opinion is that it should get some kind of buff or something.. anyway, overall stats will probably show if I was wrong ^^


  35. the new gun on the leopard (the mk103) is pretty good, the only downside is that a good portion of its shots usually result in zero damage penetrations which is a major downside for a low damage per shot gun with a long magazine reload. I'm also confused as to why the leopard doesn't get access to a 75mm gun seeing as it was originally planned to be equipped with the Kwk 41 75mm gun

  36. Ok OL - after having played for a while now, I cant find anything interesting in the new patch. For me the only real positive things are the removal of South Coast and to some degree Dragon Ridge. I hope you are able to to fix both maps, though I have my doubts regarding South Coast.

    The new tanks arnt interesting to for me (24K battles - 12x t10 + 4 t8 arti) in that regard only the Leopard I is interesting atm. I didnt even start british or chinese (= sowjet 2.0) line and wont do so in the future, maybe if a new arti tree comes along.

    New content for experienced player? Nothing since ages, I m not that interested in sensless grinds anymore ... .
    Pls introduce an optional league MM beside random battles, minimum requirement like 8K+ battles and 1200+ WN6 rating - the hordes of noobs are driving me nuts. These days I m more busy with teamkilling, swimming or jumping from cliffs than driving tanks.

    The tutorial is a small step forward in that regard, but WG wouldnt be WG, if you didnt screw up there ofc. You have to teach the newbies on how to use auto aim ... *facepalm.

    CW? broken and furthermore you do your best to make random battle 2.0 out of it with these changes in the past. Less rewards for dedicated clans and more random noobs clans on the map, which dont deserve 1 province/piece of gold in my opinion.

    The new tracers are a bad joke - on one hand everyone is complaining about the masses of arti in high tier battles, on the other hand you make it even harder to play counter arti! Seriosly what kind of monkeys do work for Wargaming, that come up with these changes and how was it possible for them to pass Supertest??? In their current form arti tracers are on big fail!!! Fix that pls ASAP!!!!

    Pz. IC seems OP - havnt played it myself, but every noob and his dog is doing it - so sure sign ... .

    What I personally would like to see before any new useless tanks (2nd german med line included):

    - garage battles
    - optional league system
    - make damage up on spotting available via your servers and in the the service record (no big task)
    - tracer fix (tank tracers can stay like the are now - dont care about them)
    - server transfer (pls stop the lame excuses, and start do something there)
    - RNG lowered to 10 - 15% ... skill ftw!!! we have enough noobs on the server
    - second EU-Server (cluster) or increased capacity for existing one, 180K players are to many ... again ... for existing server hardware
    - employ SilentStalker, the whole EU-WG team doesnt provide the amount of information ONE SINGLE PLAYER brings the EU community
    - rework your Supertest procedure, SS article how supertest is conducted ...http://ftr-wot.blogspot.de/2013/03/sos-how-does-aufklpanther-perform.html ... if that is true, no wonder so many tanks need so much rebalancing after going live

    over and out - for now


    1. forget something:

      - fix that t5 HEAT/derp issue ...

    2. Overall good summary, tho many of the points are too subjective / not valid.

  37. I am really upset with the AMD Radeon GFX issue which has been on now for nearly 2 weeks without a fix patch!! Its ridicules and there is no ETA for a fix.

    The issue massivly affects the graphics engine and causes freezes and gliches, flashing and fps hangs. Even though I can now play the game since yesterday using a workaround for the appearance of the game it hasnt fixed the other problems which were not present in 8.3.

    To me this is a disater and the support team had me jumping all over the place with settings log files etc etc all to no avail and now they wont even offer compensation for the loss of my premium account for they days it was unplayable!!

    You cant have it all ways WG. I have spent a fortune on this game and I am treated like scum!

  38. Positive:

    I like the new TD`s to grind, at least if the tier 10 stays as good as it is.

    I like the new tracers, seems more realistic to me and i like the visual more then the old.

    I dont like to lose my Luchs (tier 4 scout mm is rediculous, i dont go into detail, you already know it), cause it was the best tier 3 tank, but i am okay with that, when we get a good tier 8 scout (we don`t know if it will be good yet). So might be a positive change.


    You didnt bring the reworked or any new maps. Big minus for that.
    We need something new!
    The pace for new maps is inacceptable, even if we appreciate that you do some good stuff to make old ones better.

    I can tell you, that with the stealth nerf policy WG has now, this is a NO GO in a trustful and good relationship between gamers and developers.
    It`s hard to get peoples confidence, but easy to gamble away.
    You can see that when you go on the forums and look what ppl write about a stealth arty nerf. Even if there is none, a lot of people lose their trust.
    If you continue this way as a company, you will lose at least one customer.


    Just look at 7:45 and see how ridiculous this is.
    I can`t understand how something like this even lands on the testserver.
    Imagine you love a tank, and someone tries to change it like this.
    It didnt go live, but the devs should think more about their actions, and that ppl out there, often really care about the tanks they like.
    They should do all adjustments in the open and with reason.
    The players will get to know what they want to change anyway.

    1. Oh, one more thing to the negative:

      I dont like the new flag design.
      I bought em for all the tanks i care for, and its pretty upsetting when they get changed, and look shitty now. On some camo like desert, you cant really see them.

      I hope they get changed back, or at least you give us the chance to choose which design we like more.

  39. Hey Overlord:
    What is the maximum capacity of the European server? Because today my ping was higher than normal and a the game was very laggy for me!

    ps. when playing other games my ping was normal and around 180k players were online!

    1. Should be around 200k. Even though current peak loads are less then 200k, there can be performance issues during prime time and capacity extension is really required. This is being worked on at this stage.

    2. are u going to extend it to to 220k (or even more) or give us two clusters?

    3. finally, sometimes I have micro lags that all of my clan have at the same time

    4. Stefan_der_1,

      thinking of 2nd server for EU.

  40. Hello.

    you guys screwed up the ELC AMX without even mentioning in the notes.I demand that you return the ELC AMX's ability to rotate the hull in place to where I point my reticle.

    Or you have just stripped me the enjoyability of using this tank.

    I havent used that thing for days now because of the horrible adjustment you guys made,please fix this.

  41. Hi Overlord!
    I know it's not your bussines anymore, so If you could please forward my thanks to WG guys that screwed up VK2801 beyond believability. :/

    1. It was our pleasure. Thanks!

    2. Treat the community like this, and you will soon go bankrupt

    3. @Silviu Its called 'complacency', and its very typical for small companies that gets one huge success, and thinks they are the next Blizzard. Their downfall will come by expanding, and expanding, until they go 'pop', and burn up like another Hindenburg. The problem for WG is that they don't have another title which will be able to generate as much revenue as WoT. WoWP is a big 'who cares' - a 'flop' if you like, because it just isn't very good, and WoWS is AFAIK still not even in CB. So if they keep taking a piss at their WoT players, then the players will eventually just leave them for another title such as War Thunder, and WG will go bust.

  42. I stoped playing with T7 UK TD.
    Loader and Gunner die every game.(Gunner sometimes)
    Back to USA TD

  43. I know this isn't exactly the correct place but even though you no longer officially work on WOT you seem to provide the best support to the EU community.

    Do you know if the devs are aware that one of the game mechanic calculations has a serious flaw and falls apart when it is pushed to the extreeme.

    The mechanic in question is shell normalization of over matched shells on thin spaced armor.

    If a shell is over 3 times the diameter of armor it can not ricochet no matter the angle. If it is over twice the diameter the normalization equation is modified specially to
    Origional normalization*1.4*shell diameter/nominal armor thickness.
    Using the Brit 6mm side skirts as an example we get

    4*1.4*150/6=140 degrees

    Not the mechanic is maxed at 66degrees but still the impact of these side skirts is to make all shells hit the armor almost head on.

    How exactly does such a thin sheet of metal alter the trajectory of a shell with significant kinetic energy to that extent. This mechanic needs reworking as currently it's broken.

  44. After 8.4, started to experience so called "stuttering" - the game doesnt run smooth even if the fps (30-50) and ping (~30) are ok.
    Interesting thing is that it doesnt start immediately but after few minutes and when I go from game to desktop (alt+tab) it fixes the problem temporarily. The garage is also affected.


    I dont want to spam, I want you to know about the problem so it can be worked on :)