Could you provide some info about how to read the chart? I assume that Battle Tier is not reflected in the game anywhere, and is just an abstract definition? So, for example, Battle Tier 5 means you can expect: - Light vehicles of tier 3-5 - mediums tier 3-5 - heavies tier 4-5 - TDs tier 3-5 - SPGs tier 3-4
BTW. why does the Bison have a different spread form other T2 SPGs?
Overlod why premium tanks which has weak guns and generally are able to penetrate only vehicles from their own tier and weaker will be placed by the balance with those from 1,2 and ever 3 tiers higher? Playing Churchill or T-14 even after hard wipe will be practically a suicide. T-14 has 92 penetration which is sometimes even not enough to harm a tier 6 tank not to mention 7 and 8. Another example T2 light with tier IV? But this tank can barely penetrate tier 2 and sometimes 3. Why is that? With balance like this these tanks will be practically useless very often.
Interesting, so the Tier 8 arty wont be matched up with anything other then tier 9+ mediums and heavys. Going to have to wait in queue forever to get a game going.
Battle tiers are abstract and are not featured in game. Take T29 - tier 7 heavy tank. See 7-heavy line and find out which battle tier spread it has. In our example, from 6 to 11. The exact battle tier is chosen on a random basis. E.g. 7. Then match-making system begins processing the waiting queue, and chooses the tanks that can participate in tier 7 battles (7th column) and makes up 2 teams from them.
Tier5 Light tank facing Tier 9 TDs and Tier 10 Heavies? Am I reading this correctly? I can tell you right now, the biggest killer of this game will be this match making system. It's also the biggest complaint I hear in game on the North American Open Beta servers. #1 complaint is Match making. #2 Is the detection system. #3 Russian T-54 tanks.
I'm willing to bet people that play Tier5 Light Tanks would gladly wait in a longer queue than have to face Tier7+(let alone Tier 9-10) heavies/Tds. A Tier5 Light tank is a one shot kill for me on the T-29.
Matchmaking will kill this game for a lot of players if it's not balanced better.
But I rilly whish the tiered battles will gone for good and we will have the "normal" battles back :/ Sadly this won't happen by any chance right now...
We have just started to play the game (EU) but the matchmaking is absolutely the weakest point of it. I play with my friends in platoon with tier 3-5 tanks, but we almost always grouped together with much higher tier tanks. When we were with tier 3 only vehicles we were hunting for the tier 4 to be competitive. Than for the tier 5. But nothing has changed, the system tends to put us together with 2-3 tiers higher opponents while we are at the end of the list for free frags. The difference between the tiers is so huge, that in my opinion a maximum of +/- 1 tiers could be allowed. (Maybe 2 for lights)
The queue is extremely short, matchmaking happens just in some seconds. We just can't believe that there isn't enough players to make more balanced team. We even would like to wait more (even MUCH more) just to have a fun, well balanced battle.
To sum up I can agree with the guy above me, this system will break the game if you won't do something about it.
Tier 4 light tanks with tier 9 heavies. You're funny.
Is it really necessary to force them into a scouting role? I bet getting 13,000 experience on the A-20 for the T-34 must be extremely repetitive and boring.
I've been playing WoT for the last week now, love the game. Been waiting for a game like this for years. I even bought the medium pre-order on principle.
But my one complaint is the matchmaking as well... The tech tree forces you to gain experience on T3-4 light tanks to progress up the "medium tank" tech branches (A-20 -> T-34 and PzkpfwIII/A -> PzkpfwIII), so it's not as if people are choosing these tanks to fill the "scouting" role (not that I'm against having to do a little scouting). These lighter, lower-tier tanks have no damage capacity against all non-SPG units that are 2-3 tiers higher than they are, literally ZERO ability to damage, and, they get one shotted by most of the higher tier vehicles that they are grouped with... And that's just plain not fun... you get to sit in a bush and bounce shot after shot off opponents, or you can scout for 30 seconds before you get blown out of the water by anything that sees you.
I think its really awesome that this game has an extensive tech tree, and that you have to play to get the uber cool tanks. It's a large part of why I play. And the diversity of vehicles in matches keeps it fresh and fun.
But please, please don't make me repeatedly fight against a full house of tanks I have no chance of damaging and in turn instantly kill me. Either make the difference between tiers less significant or make the matchmaking tier ranges tighter, especially for light tanks.
I'm really not trying to be a whiner; I can take my lumps. But please go into matchmaking with an A-20 for a night, it's not fun.
Guys this is an ongoing thing and all that WOT admin are doing is locking or deleting threads on this topic. Guys, the guy that made the match system might be your buddy or your kid - but IT'S FLAWED, fire that guy. Battle after battle of tanks that can't even be scratched will kill this game.
It's real simple, there's enough people playing. Make sure any tank in any battle can actually damage any other tank - even if its insignificant (couple of percent) - any other way is simply stupid.
With the amount of players playing WOT would it be a problem to have each tank have +1/-1 tier fights? Ofc artillery and Scouts would count at +1 tier. Server would set up x amount of battles each classed as 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10. The throw in 50% of class tier and 25% each of -1/+1 tier.
Example a tier 4 fight would prioritize in taking in 50% tier 4 tanks and then take 25% tier 3 and 25% tier 5 tanks. When one battle is full then it would just make a new battle untill everyone is playing.
the match making system is already ruining the game. aswell as make the game no fun it makes alot of people leave the battles before they even start. one look at the tanks they are up against and they quit. you end up with teams a few tanks light before battle even starts. happening more and more now as people can't be arsed waiting about in a battle where they are just gonna be one-shotted by an impervious super-tank, so they just quit and run one of their other tanks
I played most of the weekend alone quite happily, but when in platoon, we were facing way too heavy tanks for us.
There were even a situation when two of us had tier 1 and 2 tanks (one of us was playing the first time) and one had tier 3 spg (SU-26) and we were really against super tanks there!
Not funny at all - except that we captured enemy flag with LTractor and PZ35(t) facing enemy KV's and such ;)
Could it be possible not to throw platoons according to the best vehicle, but with some kind of average of the players..?
Tier 8 SPG needs to be either allowed to play with tier 9 matches (ie tier 9 as highest tank) or remove the wait restriction on tier 8 SPG. The flaw in the system causes many unfair matches of 1-5 player on either side if any of tier 8 SPG wait for more than 5 min. I had several cases when it was me in Obj.261 vs Patton or other tanks, and no other player in match, just me and him. Several cases of match with 3-5 players on each side instead of 15 vs 15. Simply unacceptable.
I warned many of my friends and clans mate to avoid using Tier 8 SPG due to the flaw in system.
i need to agree with the posts above, the diffrences of tier makes such a huge impact on your effectivness, that the tier spread NEEDS to be cut down, to -1/+1 or the VERY least -2/+2
how about the platoon battle tier spread? a thought i have about this is:
ex 1: a platoon with a tier 3 light and a tier 4 TD. curent matchmaking will set platoon tier to = highest tank battle tier, resulting in platoon battle tier spread 4-7 (can't say that's right, but that's how it appears to me). then how about my idea. platoon battle tiers spread set acording to: min platoon battle tier is set to = of highest min battle tier of the tanks in the platoon, max platoon battle tier is set to = of the lowest max battle tiers of the tanks in the platoon, resulting in platoon battle tier spread is 4-5 (instead of the 4-7). the tanks battle tiers overcross (2-5 vs 4-7) when occurrence of not a crossover occur. then the platoon max battle tier is set to = to platoon min battle tier (otherwise the max battle tier would be lower than the min battle tier) ex 2: a platoon with a KV-3 and a traktor, with the curent matchmaking the traktor might get to fight tier 9 and if not a maus XD. with the idea i presented here, the highest the trakto get to fight against would be type tier 6. a traktor fighting vs tier 7 will have less negative effect on the balance, over then fighting against vs tier 9.
main idea is that the tanks in a platoon, can enter a battle where the tanks are expected to be encountered.
more or less XD
had a battle today, attacking with my light T-50 vs a lonely IS-4, actualy succesfully put him in my sircel of death with my paintgun, if he didn't had his allies not to far away, I would have painted him completely white rofl all according to the random battle balance
When are you going to give us one tier battles ? After everyone quits in rage and game looses momentum and dies due to lack of players ? Don't you and your bosses understand you have this 'enterprise' only as long as there is massive number of players. Online game dead when players base decline. Nobody likes you multitier matchmaking. NOBODY. Everyone upset and people a leaving because there are new games released. Give us ONE tier battles when all tanks in the math are balanced and have even chances. Why 2/3 of players in the match is a disadvantage and have to fight against bigger and more powerful tanks ? What is a rationale to put different tiers of tanks into single battle and then go into denial saying there is not issues with matchmaking. Open you eyes and look into forums. People are screaming about matchmaking. Don't tell me it is to complex to fix, I'm a programmer and can imagine what we a talking here. No more then week of coding given what ever complex it can be. So Why wargaming decides to insult and offend players by discriminating them in this multitier matchmaking ? Give us ONE TIER battles
0 Tier Spread (Tier 5 faces Tier 5, TD +1 tier as normal, Arty +2 Tiers as normal) 1 Tier spread (Tier 5 may face either tier 4/5 or 5 or 5/6,) 2 Tier Spread (tier 5 may face either tier 3/4/5, or 4/5 or 5 or 5/6 or 5/6/7)
This way players can select the difficulty they are feeling upto.
Like the guys point about the A20, I HATE THAT TANK, not because its a bad tank, but because WTF am I supposed to do vs Tier 8 tanks? I can't take 1 shot. NOT 1.
Just like the LEE, its not a bad tank, its a BAD MATCH MAKER.
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Why there are 2 SPG in tier 2? I believe the first one should be Light...
ReplyDeleteProbably a typo.
ReplyDeleteCould you provide some info about how to read the chart? I assume that Battle Tier is not reflected in the game anywhere, and is just an abstract definition?
So, for example, Battle Tier 5 means you can expect:
- Light vehicles of tier 3-5
- mediums tier 3-5
- heavies tier 4-5
- TDs tier 3-5
- SPGs tier 3-4
BTW. why does the Bison have a different spread form other T2 SPGs?
I'm really looking forward to meeting VK45's and IS-4's in my StuG. NOT!
ReplyDeleteNightmareMachine,
ReplyDeletefixed. Thank you.
Michał,
ReplyDeleteyes, battle tiers are abstract.
See explanation here http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php?/topic/10168-match-making-system/page__p__411161__fromsearch__1#entry411161
Overlod why premium tanks which has weak guns and generally are able to penetrate only vehicles from their own tier and weaker will be placed by the balance with those from 1,2 and ever 3 tiers higher? Playing Churchill or T-14 even after hard wipe will be practically a suicide. T-14 has 92 penetration which is sometimes even not enough to harm a tier 6 tank not to mention 7 and 8. Another example T2 light with tier IV? But this tank can barely penetrate tier 2 and sometimes 3. Why is that? With balance like this these tanks will be practically useless very often.
ReplyDeleteInteresting, so the Tier 8 arty wont be matched up with anything other then tier 9+ mediums and heavys. Going to have to wait in queue forever to get a game going.
ReplyDeleteThere's no explanation about battle tiers.Only the same chart is posted there.Can you define battle tiers?
ReplyDeleteUpdated the chart. The new one doesn't have tier 0 battles.
ReplyDeletepn,
ReplyDeleteBattle tiers are abstract and are not featured in game. Take T29 - tier 7 heavy tank.
See 7-heavy line and find out which battle tier spread it has. In our example, from 6 to 11.
The exact battle tier is chosen on a random basis. E.g. 7.
Then match-making system begins processing the waiting queue, and chooses the tanks that can participate in tier 7 battles (7th column) and makes up 2 teams from them.
Tier5 Light tank facing Tier 9 TDs and Tier 10 Heavies? Am I reading this correctly? I can tell you right now, the biggest killer of this game will be this match making system. It's also the biggest complaint I hear in game on the North American Open Beta servers. #1 complaint is Match making. #2 Is the detection system. #3 Russian T-54 tanks.
ReplyDeleteI'm willing to bet people that play Tier5 Light Tanks would gladly wait in a longer queue than have to face Tier7+(let alone Tier 9-10) heavies/Tds. A Tier5 Light tank is a one shot kill for me on the T-29.
Matchmaking will kill this game for a lot of players if it's not balanced better.
scouting?!
ReplyDeleteErrrr...
ReplyDeleteTier 11 and 12?
I maybe missed something...
But I rilly whish the tiered battles will gone for good and we will have the "normal" battles back :/
Sadly this won't happen by any chance right now...
Overlord,
ReplyDeleteAm I right in reading this that the "special" brackets for the VK1602, A-20, PZIII have been removed? And it's now just t4 light, t3 med, t4 med ...
Dead
Dear Overlord,
ReplyDeleteWe have just started to play the game (EU) but the matchmaking is absolutely the weakest point of it. I play with my friends in platoon with tier 3-5 tanks, but we almost always grouped together with much higher tier tanks. When we were with tier 3 only vehicles we were hunting for the tier 4 to be competitive. Than for the tier 5. But nothing has changed, the system tends to put us together with 2-3 tiers higher opponents while we are at the end of the list for free frags. The difference between the tiers is so huge, that in my opinion a maximum of +/- 1 tiers could be allowed. (Maybe 2 for lights)
The queue is extremely short, matchmaking happens just in some seconds. We just can't believe that there isn't enough players to make more balanced team. We even would like to wait more (even MUCH more) just to have a fun, well balanced battle.
To sum up I can agree with the guy above me, this system will break the game if you won't do something about it.
Tier 4 light tanks with tier 9 heavies. You're funny.
ReplyDeleteIs it really necessary to force them into a scouting role? I bet getting 13,000 experience on the A-20 for the T-34 must be extremely repetitive and boring.
I've been playing WoT for the last week now, love the game. Been waiting for a game like this for years. I even bought the medium pre-order on principle.
ReplyDeleteBut my one complaint is the matchmaking as well... The tech tree forces you to gain experience on T3-4 light tanks to progress up the "medium tank" tech branches (A-20 -> T-34 and PzkpfwIII/A -> PzkpfwIII), so it's not as if people are choosing these tanks to fill the "scouting" role (not that I'm against having to do a little scouting). These lighter, lower-tier tanks have no damage capacity against all non-SPG units that are 2-3 tiers higher than they are, literally ZERO ability to damage, and, they get one shotted by most of the higher tier vehicles that they are grouped with... And that's just plain not fun... you get to sit in a bush and bounce shot after shot off opponents, or you can scout for 30 seconds before you get blown out of the water by anything that sees you.
I think its really awesome that this game has an extensive tech tree, and that you have to play to get the uber cool tanks. It's a large part of why I play. And the diversity of vehicles in matches keeps it fresh and fun.
But please, please don't make me repeatedly fight against a full house of tanks I have no chance of damaging and in turn instantly kill me. Either make the difference between tiers less significant or make the matchmaking tier ranges tighter, especially for light tanks.
I'm really not trying to be a whiner; I can take my lumps. But please go into matchmaking with an A-20 for a night, it's not fun.
To sum up I can agree with the guy above me, this system will break the game if you won't do something about it.
ReplyDeleteMarch 10, 2011 4:20 PM
Thought I'd repost cuz u guys don't seem to get it.........
Guys this is an ongoing thing and all that WOT admin are doing is locking or deleting threads on this topic. Guys, the guy that made the match system might be your buddy or your kid - but IT'S FLAWED, fire that guy. Battle after battle of tanks that can't even be scratched will kill this game.
ReplyDeleteIt's real simple, there's enough people playing. Make sure any tank in any battle can actually damage any other tank - even if its insignificant (couple of percent) - any other way is simply stupid.
Match after match of "didn't penetrate" or "bounced off: - like really? How many people actually have to point this out to you guys?
ReplyDeleteWith the amount of players playing WOT would it be a problem to have each tank have +1/-1 tier fights?
ReplyDeleteOfc artillery and Scouts would count at +1 tier.
Server would set up x amount of battles each classed as 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8-9-10.
The throw in 50% of class tier and 25% each of -1/+1 tier.
Example a tier 4 fight would prioritize in taking in 50% tier 4 tanks and then take 25% tier 3 and 25% tier 5 tanks.
When one battle is full then it would just make a new battle untill everyone is playing.
I give up, f....k this game!..
ReplyDeletethe match making system is already ruining the game. aswell as make the game no fun it makes alot of people leave the battles before they even start. one look at the tanks they are up against and they quit. you end up with teams a few tanks light before battle even starts. happening more and more now as people can't be arsed waiting about in a battle where they are just gonna be one-shotted by an impervious super-tank, so they just quit and run one of their other tanks
ReplyDeleteI played most of the weekend alone quite happily, but when in platoon, we were facing way too heavy tanks for us.
ReplyDeleteThere were even a situation when two of us had tier 1 and 2 tanks (one of us was playing the first time) and one had tier 3 spg (SU-26) and we were really against super tanks there!
Not funny at all - except that we captured enemy flag with LTractor and PZ35(t) facing enemy KV's and such ;)
Could it be possible not to throw platoons according to the best vehicle, but with some kind of average of the players..?
Tier 8 SPG needs to be either allowed to play with tier 9 matches (ie tier 9 as highest tank) or remove the wait restriction on tier 8 SPG. The flaw in the system causes many unfair matches of 1-5 player on either side if any of tier 8 SPG wait for more than 5 min. I had several cases when it was me in Obj.261 vs Patton or other tanks, and no other player in match, just me and him. Several cases of match with 3-5 players on each side instead of 15 vs 15. Simply unacceptable.
ReplyDeleteI warned many of my friends and clans mate to avoid using Tier 8 SPG due to the flaw in system.
i need to agree with the posts above, the diffrences of tier makes such a huge impact on your effectivness, that the tier spread NEEDS to be cut down, to -1/+1 or the VERY least -2/+2
ReplyDeletehow about the platoon battle tier spread?
ReplyDeletea thought i have about this is:
ex 1: a platoon with a tier 3 light and a tier 4 TD. curent matchmaking will set platoon tier to = highest tank battle tier, resulting in platoon battle tier spread 4-7 (can't say that's right, but that's how it appears to me).
then how about my idea. platoon battle tiers spread set acording to:
min platoon battle tier is set to = of highest min battle tier of the tanks in the platoon, max platoon battle tier is set to = of the lowest max battle tiers of the tanks in the platoon,
resulting in platoon battle tier spread is 4-5 (instead of the 4-7). the tanks battle tiers overcross (2-5 vs 4-7)
when occurrence of not a crossover occur. then the platoon max battle tier is set to = to platoon min battle tier (otherwise the max battle tier would be lower than the min battle tier)
ex 2: a platoon with a KV-3 and a traktor, with the curent matchmaking the traktor might get to fight tier 9 and if not a maus XD. with the idea i presented here, the highest the trakto get to fight against would be type tier 6.
a traktor fighting vs tier 7 will have less negative effect on the balance, over then fighting against vs tier 9.
main idea is that the tanks in a platoon, can enter a battle where the tanks are expected to be encountered.
more or less XD
had a battle today, attacking with my light T-50 vs a lonely IS-4, actualy succesfully put him in my sircel of death with my paintgun, if he didn't had his allies not to far away, I would have painted him completely white rofl
all according to the random battle balance
When are you going to give us one tier battles ? After everyone quits in rage and game looses momentum and dies due to lack of players ?
ReplyDeleteDon't you and your bosses understand you have this 'enterprise' only as long as there is massive number of players. Online game dead when players base decline.
Nobody likes you multitier matchmaking. NOBODY.
Everyone upset and people a leaving because there are new games released.
Give us ONE tier battles when all tanks in the math are balanced and have even chances.
Why 2/3 of players in the match is a disadvantage and have to fight against bigger and more powerful tanks ?
What is a rationale to put different tiers of tanks into single battle and then go into denial saying there is not issues with matchmaking. Open you eyes and look into forums. People are screaming about matchmaking.
Don't tell me it is to complex to fix, I'm a programmer and can imagine what we a talking here. No more then week of coding given what ever complex it can be.
So Why wargaming decides to insult and offend players by discriminating them in this multitier matchmaking ? Give us ONE TIER battles
What about selecting the Tiers you feel up to?
ReplyDeleteHow about some kind of spread selection?
Easy to select:
0 Tier Spread (Tier 5 faces Tier 5, TD +1 tier as normal, Arty +2 Tiers as normal)
1 Tier spread (Tier 5 may face either tier 4/5 or 5 or 5/6,)
2 Tier Spread (tier 5 may face either tier 3/4/5, or 4/5 or 5 or 5/6 or 5/6/7)
This way players can select the difficulty they are feeling upto.
Like the guys point about the A20, I HATE THAT TANK, not because its a bad tank, but because WTF am I supposed to do vs Tier 8 tanks? I can't take 1 shot. NOT 1.
Just like the LEE, its not a bad tank, its a BAD MATCH MAKER.
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DeleteFor long-distance touring? For off-road riding? Would carbon MTB frameyou like to get into racing?
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And as large American companies consolidate the industry by buying out smaller bike manufacturers,
brand names are becoming even more confusing and irrelevant.
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